January 2021 Featured Artist
IF HE COULD SEE ME NOW
Interview with Bettye LaVette
Blues Hall of Famer & Six-Time Grammy Nominee
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Photo Credit: Joseph A. Rosen
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Hailed by the New York Times as “one of the great soul interpreters of her generation,” six-time Grammy nominee Bettye LaVette is a vocalist who can take any type of song – jazz or country, pop or rhythm & blues – and make it her own. Bettye’s commitment to artistry has earned the admiration of musical peers, such as Jon Bon Jovi. “She doesn’t just sing the song, she lives in each of them,” he said. Singer-songwriter Bonnie Raitt also praised her as “…one of the most incredible R&B singers singing today…a force of nature.”
Born Betty Jo Haskins in Muskegon, Michigan, she moved at a young age to Detroit’s North End, where her neighbors included 1950s music stars such as Jackie Wilson. In 1962, at the age of 16, she stepped into a recording studio for the first time, and the result was a top 10 rhythm & blues hit, “My Man – He’s a Lovin’ Man.” Released on Atlantic Records, the song made Bettye an overnight star. She returned to the charts in 1965 with “Let Me Down Easy” and, in 1969, with “He Made a Woman out of Me.” After her first full-length album, Child of the Seventies, was inexplicably shelved by Atlantic in 1972 (it would finally be released in 2000), Bettye turned to the theatrical stage, appearing in a national tour of Broadway’s Bubbling Brown Sugar. In 1982, she signed with her hometown label, Motown, to release Tell Me a Lie. The album’s hit single, “Right in the Middle (of Falling in Love),” brought her a new round of critical and popular acclaim. |
In the early 1990s she was a regular performer on the UK’s “northern soul” scene, where she had a dedicated British fan base. Then, in 2003, A Woman Like Me won the W.C. Handy Award for Comeback Blues Album of the Year and marked the onset of her career revival.
In 2005, she signed with ANTI- Records for I’ve Got My Own Hell to Raise, a collection of songs from female writers, and, in 2006, she received a Pioneer Award from the Rhythm & Blues Foundation. In December 2008, Bettye delivered her rendition of The Who’s “Love Reign O’er Me” at the Kennedy Center Honors to a captivated audience. The following January, she performed “A Change Is Gonna Come” with Jon Bon Jovi as part of Barack Obama’s inaugural celebrations. Things Have Changed (2018), an album of Bob Dylan songs produced by Steve Jordan, marked Bettye’s Verve debut and two Grammy nominations.
In May 2020, Bettye was inducted into the Blues Hall of Fame (The Blues Foundation). Her latest album, Blackbirds, has garnered Bettye her sixth Grammy nomination for “Best Contemporary Blues Album.” In curating the songs for Blackbirds, Bettye has established a dialogue with the great women who preceded her while reaffirming herself as a vital, living presence.
In 2005, she signed with ANTI- Records for I’ve Got My Own Hell to Raise, a collection of songs from female writers, and, in 2006, she received a Pioneer Award from the Rhythm & Blues Foundation. In December 2008, Bettye delivered her rendition of The Who’s “Love Reign O’er Me” at the Kennedy Center Honors to a captivated audience. The following January, she performed “A Change Is Gonna Come” with Jon Bon Jovi as part of Barack Obama’s inaugural celebrations. Things Have Changed (2018), an album of Bob Dylan songs produced by Steve Jordan, marked Bettye’s Verve debut and two Grammy nominations.
In May 2020, Bettye was inducted into the Blues Hall of Fame (The Blues Foundation). Her latest album, Blackbirds, has garnered Bettye her sixth Grammy nomination for “Best Contemporary Blues Album.” In curating the songs for Blackbirds, Bettye has established a dialogue with the great women who preceded her while reaffirming herself as a vital, living presence.
Editor’s Note: Like so many, I am fan of Bettye LaVette’s incredible voice, her strength and her perseverance in an industry that has taken down so many. Where others may have given up, Bettye defied the odds and forged forward, even though success was often elusive. Although this interview barely scratches the surface of her journey, which is full of many twists and turns, you’ll find a glimpse into her story here.
In December, I spoke with Bettye about her lifelong career, Jim Lewis (her mentor who kept her on track and always believed in her), and her acclaimed, new album, Blackbirds, which is up for a Grammy later this month. Perhaps, the sixth time is the charm. ~ Myrna Haskell, executive editor
At sixteen, you recorded “My Man – He’s a Lovin’ Man,” and it was picked up by Atlantic Records. Did this early success shape your decades-long career in any way?
Absolutely! If you start your career singing in choirs and talent shows, it’s very different. I was an awful child in school, so they wouldn’t let me sing in the choir. When Atlantic picked [my song] up, I had only been Bettye LaVette for two weeks, and we hadn’t even pressed it yet. I was going to meet these people I had heard on the radio. I had been dancing to their records the year before, and suddenly, I was performing with them at record hops. It was thrilling, and it all happened fast!
Any pitfalls along the way that made you stronger and more resilient?
Laughing. I had all of them!
Who guided you and gave you good advice along the way?
Jim Lewis was among my first managers. I met him around the time that I was being released from my Atlantic contract. He was an executive in the musicians’ union. I wasn’t in love with my voice. I just wanted to be in show business. But he saw something in me and wanted to train me. I said I was leaving for New York and not coming back [to Detroit]. I did come back – several times – and he was there.
He was a drill sergeant. These songs were forced on me - I didn’t really want to sing them. Those standards weren’t the songs I was interested in at the time.
He told me, ‘You have a cute booty, but you have to learn how to sing.’ And it took Jim years to teach me!
Bettye laughs as she reminisces. Young people want to sound like their friends. I would say, ‘I have to sing what? You want me to sing like this because you want me to be old like you!’
One day, we were driving down the freeway, and I was running my mouth about things I still didn’t understand. He slammed on the brakes, pulled over and put me out. He said, ‘You’re too stupid to ride.’
Jim Lewis brought out the things he saw in me and made an entertainer out of me. He helped me find my own niche.
He was a dedicated mentor for you.
That he was.
The music industry has been notoriously hard for women. Were you pressured early in your career to look a certain way, sound a certain way?
I was totally conducive to this business. When I was four, I used to dress up in my mom’s high heels, and I would put her hair pieces in. Then, I’d sit out on the porch to show off. I wanted to be this woman. I wanted to go right on and be grown up.
In December, I spoke with Bettye about her lifelong career, Jim Lewis (her mentor who kept her on track and always believed in her), and her acclaimed, new album, Blackbirds, which is up for a Grammy later this month. Perhaps, the sixth time is the charm. ~ Myrna Haskell, executive editor
At sixteen, you recorded “My Man – He’s a Lovin’ Man,” and it was picked up by Atlantic Records. Did this early success shape your decades-long career in any way?
Absolutely! If you start your career singing in choirs and talent shows, it’s very different. I was an awful child in school, so they wouldn’t let me sing in the choir. When Atlantic picked [my song] up, I had only been Bettye LaVette for two weeks, and we hadn’t even pressed it yet. I was going to meet these people I had heard on the radio. I had been dancing to their records the year before, and suddenly, I was performing with them at record hops. It was thrilling, and it all happened fast!
Any pitfalls along the way that made you stronger and more resilient?
Laughing. I had all of them!
Who guided you and gave you good advice along the way?
Jim Lewis was among my first managers. I met him around the time that I was being released from my Atlantic contract. He was an executive in the musicians’ union. I wasn’t in love with my voice. I just wanted to be in show business. But he saw something in me and wanted to train me. I said I was leaving for New York and not coming back [to Detroit]. I did come back – several times – and he was there.
He was a drill sergeant. These songs were forced on me - I didn’t really want to sing them. Those standards weren’t the songs I was interested in at the time.
He told me, ‘You have a cute booty, but you have to learn how to sing.’ And it took Jim years to teach me!
Bettye laughs as she reminisces. Young people want to sound like their friends. I would say, ‘I have to sing what? You want me to sing like this because you want me to be old like you!’
One day, we were driving down the freeway, and I was running my mouth about things I still didn’t understand. He slammed on the brakes, pulled over and put me out. He said, ‘You’re too stupid to ride.’
Jim Lewis brought out the things he saw in me and made an entertainer out of me. He helped me find my own niche.
He was a dedicated mentor for you.
That he was.
The music industry has been notoriously hard for women. Were you pressured early in your career to look a certain way, sound a certain way?
I was totally conducive to this business. When I was four, I used to dress up in my mom’s high heels, and I would put her hair pieces in. Then, I’d sit out on the porch to show off. I wanted to be this woman. I wanted to go right on and be grown up.
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I am blown away by your version of Bill Withers’s “Ain’t No Sunshine” and your performance of The Who’s “Love Reign O’er Me” at the Kennedy Center.* What do you like about the process of reinventing a song? The process is nothing. I hate the word ‘cover.’** I’m an interpreter. I reinterpret songs. I can’t sing like Paul McCartney or Bill Withers. I can only sing like me, so that’s what I do. *In 2008, Bettye performed “Love Reign O’er Me” at The Kennedy Center in Washington, D.C. for the annual Kennedy Center Honors event. She has since been included in “best performances of all time lists” for this event. **Cover (or cover song): a recording of a song that was made popular by someone else. Note: Bettye attributes her manager Jim Lewis for training her so that she is able to sing just about anything – in any genre – and make it her own. |
Bettye Performs "Love Reign O'er Me" at the Kennedy Center
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Click album cover for a snippet of Bettye singing "Blackbird."
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Blackbirds was released in August of this year and features songs popularized by other iconic, black female artists. Is there a common thread that links the songs together?
Yes! They’re all black women who don’t sound usual.* Well, Nancy Wilson is maybe the only one who has that traditional voice. [Bettye’s version of Wilson’s “Save Your Love for Me” is one of the tracks on the album.] I didn’t have that gospely or Baptist voice like many of my contemporaries. I wasn’t a fluffy girl. *The album honors the great women of jazz, blues and R&B: Nina Simone, Sharon Robinson, Della Reese, Ruth Brown, Lil Green, Dinah Washington, Billie Holiday & Nancy Wilson. |
Let’s talk about the song “Blackbird,” specifically the lines, “Take these broken wings and learn to fly. All of my life, I have waited for this moment to be free.” How does this sentiment relate to where you are now, both in your career and personally?
My husband [Kevin Kiley] knows all things music. He narrowed things down for me. But I knew this one was it. The words are so applicable to my life.* Some people don’t realize that British men call their women birds. He’s [Paul McCartney] singing about a girl.
I sang “Blackbird” at the tribute to the Beatles at the Hollywood Bowl.** It was a packed, beautiful summer evening. I thought look at me when these 32 strings came in for rehearsal. I broke down crying when they came in. It was just overwhelming.
*"Blackbird" is the only song on the album that was not originally popularized by a black, female artist, but it certainly describes Bettye's journey; and the changed lyrics to first-person narrative drives the message home.
**July 9, 2010: Bettye performed at “The Beatles Celebration” at the Hollywood Bowl in Los Angeles, CA. “Blackbird” (written by Paul McCartney) was one of four songs in her set.
My husband [Kevin Kiley] knows all things music. He narrowed things down for me. But I knew this one was it. The words are so applicable to my life.* Some people don’t realize that British men call their women birds. He’s [Paul McCartney] singing about a girl.
I sang “Blackbird” at the tribute to the Beatles at the Hollywood Bowl.** It was a packed, beautiful summer evening. I thought look at me when these 32 strings came in for rehearsal. I broke down crying when they came in. It was just overwhelming.
*"Blackbird" is the only song on the album that was not originally popularized by a black, female artist, but it certainly describes Bettye's journey; and the changed lyrics to first-person narrative drives the message home.
**July 9, 2010: Bettye performed at “The Beatles Celebration” at the Hollywood Bowl in Los Angeles, CA. “Blackbird” (written by Paul McCartney) was one of four songs in her set.
This was a triumph.
If Jim Lewis could see me now…if he hadn’t died. Ha! If he could just see me now.
I have to tell you. I’m very spiritual - he sees you.
Bettye takes a long pause.
Well, I hope you’re right.
Which of the songs on the album is your favorite to perform?
They all mean something completely different for me. It’s hard to pinpoint one or two. I just need to find a reason to sing the words.
How has this global pandemic affected your work?
You know, 2020 turned out to be the biggest year of my entire career! Earlier this year, I won Best Soul Blues Female Artist at the Blues Music Awards [her third Blues Music Awards win]. I was inducted into the Blues Hall of Fame. And Blackbirds is up for Best Contemporary Blues Album, my sixth Grammy nomination.
It’s hard, though. I sit here…don’t know when I’ll be going somewhere. I’m an old woman.
I wouldn’t call you old!
This is my 59th year [in this business]. Motivation is hard. But that’s what you do. You get up every day and do what needs to be done.
You have said that “singing is a physical activity.” How have you kept your vocals in such good shape? So many singers lose their voices after decades of performing.
Laughing. Well, I’ll tell you something straight out of Jim Lewis’s mouth - ‘Just shut up and go to bed!’
So, you definitely need your sleep!
Yes! And I watch everything that goes into my mouth.
I’ve been doing this all of my life. I’ve been Bettye LaVette for 59 years. I was only Betty Jo Haskins for 16. And I have a vanity for this business. You don’t smoke before you go on stage. I smoke marijuana, but never before I go on stage. It makes you sing harder, and that’s not good for your voice. I always put my music and my voice first. But, when I was young, I ran my mouth and stayed up late.
If Jim Lewis could see me now…if he hadn’t died. Ha! If he could just see me now.
I have to tell you. I’m very spiritual - he sees you.
Bettye takes a long pause.
Well, I hope you’re right.
Which of the songs on the album is your favorite to perform?
They all mean something completely different for me. It’s hard to pinpoint one or two. I just need to find a reason to sing the words.
How has this global pandemic affected your work?
You know, 2020 turned out to be the biggest year of my entire career! Earlier this year, I won Best Soul Blues Female Artist at the Blues Music Awards [her third Blues Music Awards win]. I was inducted into the Blues Hall of Fame. And Blackbirds is up for Best Contemporary Blues Album, my sixth Grammy nomination.
It’s hard, though. I sit here…don’t know when I’ll be going somewhere. I’m an old woman.
I wouldn’t call you old!
This is my 59th year [in this business]. Motivation is hard. But that’s what you do. You get up every day and do what needs to be done.
You have said that “singing is a physical activity.” How have you kept your vocals in such good shape? So many singers lose their voices after decades of performing.
Laughing. Well, I’ll tell you something straight out of Jim Lewis’s mouth - ‘Just shut up and go to bed!’
So, you definitely need your sleep!
Yes! And I watch everything that goes into my mouth.
I’ve been doing this all of my life. I’ve been Bettye LaVette for 59 years. I was only Betty Jo Haskins for 16. And I have a vanity for this business. You don’t smoke before you go on stage. I smoke marijuana, but never before I go on stage. It makes you sing harder, and that’s not good for your voice. I always put my music and my voice first. But, when I was young, I ran my mouth and stayed up late.
You’ve managed to outlast so many others in a cutthroat industry, and you’re doing it your way. How do you keep on keepin’ on?
You have to study your craft. Those who know the most, get the most.
It’s all I know how do. I’ve devoted every moment of my life to it. This is what you have to do - unless you’re a genius and can just get up and do shit.
I’m the oldest one out there with a new record contract. I didn’t finance my new album myself. That’s what many [artists] my age are doing.
Bettye also has her favorite things.
I enjoy champagne, shoes and marijuana. Well, I also want to be able to give money to my grandchildren.
How many grandchildren do you have?
Two.
You have to study your craft. Those who know the most, get the most.
It’s all I know how do. I’ve devoted every moment of my life to it. This is what you have to do - unless you’re a genius and can just get up and do shit.
I’m the oldest one out there with a new record contract. I didn’t finance my new album myself. That’s what many [artists] my age are doing.
Bettye also has her favorite things.
I enjoy champagne, shoes and marijuana. Well, I also want to be able to give money to my grandchildren.
How many grandchildren do you have?
Two.
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That’s wonderful. I don’t have grandchildren yet, but I’ve heard the saying, ‘If I knew having grandchildren would be this much fun, I would have had them first.’
Ha! Yeah, I’ve heard that. My daughter isn’t that much younger than me. I had her when I was just fifteen years old. People have asked, ‘If you had to do it over, would you do things differently?’ The answer is that I’d do it the same all over again. I wasn’t ready to be a mother, but my own mother and my sister wanted to be [my daughter’s] mother. And she never needed anything – she was always taken care of. They were stable mothers for her, and I was [committed to] pursuing my career. My daughter and I have had our ups and downs, but she understands now. |
“But if you’re really a singer, you gotta sing. Your need to sing is greater than your pride, and you sing whenever and wherever you can – and that’s just what I did.” ~ Quote from Bettye's memoir: A Woman Like Me (Betty LaVette with David Ritz) |
What advice would you give your sixteen-year-old self if you could go back in time and talk with her?
Back then, I just wanted to stand there and look pretty. So, I would tell her, ‘Learn to play an instrument, so you can tell all the musicians to kiss your ass!’
Where do you find sanctuary?
I have a huge yard, and I’ve got lots of plants in my house, too. When I’m working with my plants or cooking or playing games of solitaire, I’m thinking of something else at the same time. It’s the act of doing something [physical] while mentally being somewhere else. It’s relaxing.
You know, all I ever asked for was for everyone to know my name and a husband who loves me.
And Bettye has both of those things now. She has the love and devotion of her husband, Kevin Kiley, and, in what she has often called her “Fifth Career,” she is finally where she always wanted to be – at the top.
